donutsweeper | ao3 changes babble and recs

There's been some discussion in some exchange circles I'm in due to AO3's plan to roll out changes to give users more control over who can give them gift works. On the face of it, it's a good way of dealing with the harassment some people have faced at being gifted things upsetting to them or that they do not want. When enabled (as it will be for all current AO3 accounts), it'll be like it is currently and will not affect your ability to be given gifts. If disabled (which it will be automatically for any account created after it goes into place) "the only users who will be able to give you works are users who have either been assigned to create a fanwork for you in a gift exchange or claimed one of your non-anonymous prompts in a prompt meme."

The problem I see with that is the assigned to aspect of it. If writing for an assigned recip it's fine, however treats are another story. It'll be possible to write something and then not be able to gift it because it's a treat rather than assignment and you won't know if you'll be able to gift it or not until you try. It'll also mess with the way some exchanges deal with late pinch hits and whatnot as well.

95% of what I write is treats. There's going to be so many kinks to iron out and worry about when AO3 implements it. I'm trying not to stress too much or be overly discouraged about it beforehand but that's not easy. SIGH

Anyway, have this week's

recthething recs (MDZS/The Untamed fic recs):

behind the words by sunflowersfield (3.7k, archive locked)
Summary: Wei Wuxian is searching for a little bit of happiness and the perfect bookstore. Along the way, he finds Lan Wangji. A bookstore AU loosely based on this tweet: “I went on a first date at a bookstore and he paid for all my books…” (tender and sweet)

Just Call by tinylilremus (2.5k)
Summary Snippet: Or, that time that Lan Wangji tripped over his pet rabbit, tried to call his brother to help him, and called Wei Wuxian instead. (utterly adorable)

an observer's guide to lovestruck cultivators by cafecliche (2.5k)
Summary Snippet: Or: Wei Wuxian and Lan Wangji make one more stop at Luo Qingyang's home before their journey to the Burial Mounds, and her husband reflects on the world she left behind (wonderful outsider POV of WWX and LWJ)

the soft animal of your body by howodd5ever (21k, MDZS Reverse Big Bang)
Summary Snippet: Wei Wuxian sets off alone after the events at Guanyin Temple and finds himself in pretty serious trouble. (a lovely, sometimes injury muddled, WWX POV tale, told interspersed between letters)

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Oh wow, yeah, this really can mess up treating... My instinctual reaction is "I don't like it", even if I understand where they're coming from.

Yeah that was exactly my initial reaction. People being harassed by unwanted gifts is terrible, but ugh, treating is going to be a pain. :(

There's this comment: https://archiveofourown.org/comments/509502706

And I really wish they made the call to allow all exchange-related works instead :( or at least make it a third option in settings.

Yeah. It's going to be a huge issue for mods as well because a lot of times with late pinch hits they are trying to ensure someone has a gift without using the assignment to fill it. For example: they discover A's gift is a placeholder or has a DNW- technically the assignment has been filled so they can't just reassign it but their exchange ensures that if you fulfill your own assignment you will get a gift. If A has the thing toggled so as to not get a non-assigned gift, what is a mod supposed to do? And worse, the mod won't *know* that if they just get a pinchhitter to write it that the PH won't be able to be posted until the pinchhitter tries to do it.

I've seen some people saying that mods can just make posts and tell people to check their settings to make sure they allow gifts, but I'm very jaded and have been doing exchanges for well over a decade and know that no matter how many posts mods make and no matter how clear the posts are there are some people who won't read/follow them so it'll still be an issue.

I'm very jaded and have been doing exchanges for well over a decade and know that no matter how many posts mods make and no matter how clear the posts are there are some people who won't read/follow them so it'll still be an issue.
I've been modding exchanges too, and YEAH. My faith in this respect is non-existent. And either way, it'll add yet more work.

Exactly! I mean I guess mods can add to the 'if you fulfill your assignment you are guaranteed a gift' rule to have it say 'if you fulfill your assignment AND you have the accept gifts option toggled (see here to check) then you are guaranteed a gift' or something like that, but still.... changes the feel of things and will still be more work because people will bug the mods when they can't gift the things they created and people will still complain if they don't get something because they won't have read the fine print.

Also honestly, it'd be pretty discouraging to write a gift and learn you can't actually gift it after that :/

absolutely!! I saw some talk of allowing people to gift them to the exchange in general or to create a "Whatnot exchange gift account" type thing (there used to be a yuletide fairy account for this ages ago) for when it happens but... I write *for* someone; based off a specific prompt usually with someone's likes and requests in mind. I don't want to just toss it in the archive randomly after all that work.

I write *for* someone; based off a specific prompt usually with someone's likes and requests in mind. I don't want to just toss it in the archive randomly after all that work.
Yeah, I feel the same :( Though at least in exchanges with letters, I'd like to assume that if someone goes to all the effort of writing one, they'll be open to treats...

One would hope. Then again, with exchange culture the way it is, some people sign up for tons of exchanges and write letters but can't be bothered comment on their gifts so who knows.

...a good point 😬

I totally understand the reasoning but making the default for new people 'not to accept gifts' really works against exchange culture which is sad imho.

Same, I wish that new (post-implementation) accounts would be the same as the current ones and have it something that has to be opted into.

I'm sure it's not feasible but I'd love to see a membership vote on AO3 for whether we think it should be 'opt in' or 'opt out' as I don't think people who respond to such a post necessarily reflect the majority opinion.

That would be nice if it was offered as a vote.

I don't know what the majority opinion on it is. I suspect it's definitely dependent on where you're coming from. I haven't looked at the comments since a few hours after it was posted but I definitely recognized many of the names of people bringing up exchange difficulties as people who understand the bigger picture of it due to being in exchanges. I think a lot of people don't do exchanges (or, if they do, never treat) so don't see the issues this change might cause.

I would appreciate it if AO3 could explain how big an issue this actually is. From a subjective POV, I don't personally know anyone who has mentioned this being an issue for them but that doesn't mean it isn't a huge issue and I get that.

However, if it isn't a huge issue then I'd like to see protections for exchange culture, hence 'opt in.'

... at the very least, I agree with the people who'd like to be able to see an indication on the person's gift page that they've turned off gifts outside of their exchange gift so I could add one more step to the treating process to check if they're even open to it before starting down that road.

Yeah, it'd be annoying to have to check each time I'm considering treating, but a lot less annoying than if I wrote something and then couldn't gift it.

I've seen a few people commenting/complaining about harassment via gifts but harassment via comments seems a LOT more common. I guess the archive doing something to disallow gifts is a lot easier than creating the blocking feature that would prevent that kind of comment harassment (although blocking, dependingly, would also affect gift giving but not as much)

Like you, I've seen it mostly through comments.

Honestly, I'd settle for them making it 'opt in' for new archive members, particularly as it can be 'toggled' for exchanges but only if people know it's there.

Edited 2022-02-05 18:03 (UTC)

Yeah, if it were exclusively something you had to opt in for might be the best option. Because combining mew-to-exchanges + automatic-opt-out = lots of people confused about why they're not getting/able to give treats. *sigh*

ao3 changes babble and recs

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject